Talk:Hong Meiling

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Revision as of 21:15, 10 January 2022 by PK (talk | contribs) ("She is known to sleep on the job.")
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Name romanization[edit]

How come she's called Hong Meirin instead of Hóng Mĕilíng, which would be the correct pīnyīn transcription of her obviously Chinese name? Makes as much sense as callin Remilia Scarlet Remiria Sukâretto to me... --130.232.131.47 05:52, 2 January 2007 (PST)

Ask Tasogare Frontier. -7HS 07:16, 2 January 2007 (PST)
A Japanese company romanizing something? Figures. Still, it's silly. --130.232.131.47 07:35, 2 January 2007 (PST)
Actually, about that. We don't call Medicine "Medicin Meloncory", and we tend to avoid Kunrei-style romanizations (Onoduka, Huziwara, etc.), and yes, we don't have her name as Hoan Meirin. I think it makes sense to move the article to Hong Meiling, personally. --T. Solamarle 11:28, 22 May 2007 (PDT)

In Gumonsiki, her name is romanized as Hoan Meirin. Go figure. --130.232.131.47 13:21, 3 January 2007 (PST)

Surname[edit]

Something I've always wondered- Meiling/Meirin is her first/given name right? Hong is her last/surname? I know in some countries like Japan the surname is written first, but why is she the only character on the wiki besides Mokou and possibly Shikieiki(?) whose name isn't switched around for Western/English-speaking audience? Shouldn't she be Meiling Hong? I know it doesn't have the same ring to it, but it just seems odd to switch the name order of nearly everyone else and leave hers the same. For that matter, is it it the Hong part that's mispronounced as Kurenai and the Meiling part that's called Misuzu? So if I wanted to write a comic or something and didn't want to write the whole Kurenai Misuzu would it make more sense to say Misuzu (as a first name)?

Indeed, in Chinese and Japanese last names are always written first. Usually, modern Japanese names (approximately after the Meizi restoration) are flipped in English (and most western) context. We speak, for instance, of the Japanese Prime Minister Sinzô Abe, not Abe Sinzô. Following the surname-given name order is usually reserved for "less educated" instances, such as fansubs or the like, and can be considered somewhat amateurish. Now, for some reason, Chinese names do not get flipped even in English texts (for example Mao Zedong, never Zedong Mao), and this is the category Meiling falls under. She stands out because she's the only one. So it's basically just a convention, but one much larger than just the Tôhô circles. When writing in Japanese, the problem, of course, doesn't exist. Misuzu Kurenai would be one possible Japanese reading for her name, were it not Chinese, with 紅 (Hóng) being the Kurenai part. Meiling is indeed her given name. --爆龍 15:14, 26 May 2007 (PDT)
Comeplement. 爆龍's explanation for romanization of Japanese name has a little short. In 2000, the Agency for Cultural Affairs announced that it should be more appropriate, not less-educated, to spell Japanese names in family-personal order & make family name capitalized. (In fact, I was taught so in Japanese junior highschool.) So if we follow it, we should spell ASŌ Tarō in Hepburn style, & ASÔ Tarô in Kunrei Shiki (ASOU Tarou should be OK, I think). But of course, people may hesitate to decide which spelling is better, so they say that spelling is "more appropriate", which means the former spelling style may be OK. Finally, what I want to say is: the present-day educationally good spelling is "FAMILY NAME - Personal name" but "Personal name - Family name" is also OK. --Masuo64 13:51, 27 November 2008 (UTC)

Saimoe[edit]

The article mentions her winning the second Touhou Saimoe tournament. I noticed this is the only place any of the Saimoe tournaments have even been mentioned. Could we get some more information on those in a new article? 88.217.45.254 12:17, 4 September 2007 (PDT)

The Saimoe tournament seems to be something on "2ch" (2chan?), but wikipedia had this link on their touhou page- Touhou Saimoe 2 official website and contest results. I really don't understand how the voting worked (especially with it all in Japanese), and I'm not positive that this is the same "saimoe tournament" that's on 2ch. The voting structure looks similiar to the past 2ch contest results page I saw but I don't know that much about it all. *later* I looked at it again and it all makes sense, even though I still can't read it. In the first round every character was paired up with another. Meiling beat Renko 587 to 234. Then the winners of each round are paired up for another round. Meiling then beat Youmu 792 to 560. After that she beat Lily White 667 to 383. Then she beat Flandre 868 to 589 and lastly beat Sakuya 854 to 788. The way the tiers are set up though some characters had a better or worse chance of making it to the later rounds than others just because of who they were paired with or because near the bottom some of them had to go through an extra round of voting. -Redpanda
In the event that an article is created, Yuyuko Saigyouji won the first Touhou Saimoe. I'm not able to link to it here because of the anti-spam filter.
There has not been a third event.

Pants[edit]

Probably not worth mentioning on Mei Ling's actual page, but there's some evidence back up the whole theory that Mei Ling got pants in the fighting games to avoid indecency. Mainly, in an interview (one of the ones linked to from this wiki that's been translated), ZUN has stated that the "indecency" of certain fanworks of Touhou is "unfortunate" but "can't be helped". Given that ZUN has an aversion to this sort of thing, it's not surprising he'd put pants on Mei Ling for the fighting games to avoid it.

Mei Ling also doesn't seem to be wearing pants in either her Perfect Memento art or her portrayals in various official mangas (SSiB, SnBND, etc)

TiamatRoar 13:50, September 30, 2010 (UTC)


Kanji on hat[edit]

It is said in the article that the kanji on her hat is "long", but which kanji is that exactly? I have a couple matches for that reading in my dictionary. Two are very similar, presumably one is traditional and the other simplified. I can't tell from the pictures. --72.48.100.121 21:37, 31 March 2008 (PDT)

It means "Dragon" and is pronounced "long." 69.226.213.192 23:26, 31 March 2008 (PDT)
Just out of curiosity, it's pronounced "long" in what language? Mandarin? Cantonese? I assume it's not Japanese since the usual pronunciations are りょう (ryou)、りゅう (ryuu)、and たつ (tatsu).--Meronpan 19:20, 14 August 2009 (UTC)
It's pronounced 'lóng' in Chinese/Mandarin. Also take note that the character '龍' on her beret is written in the traditional chinese character: today's Simplified Chinese equivalent will be written as '龙', and they both sound the same. Furthermore, i seriously doubt that the character is Kanji but is rather old Chinese since Hong Meiling is definitely a Chinese youkai and the Japanese Kanji is basically a rip off traditional Chinese characters with different pronunciations.218.186.10.228 08:26, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

"occasional punching bag"[edit]

I've seen Meiling get knived by Sakuya many times, since I've seen Touhou. But where did this happen exactly? Fairy Maid 00:06, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

I might be wrong, but I think in Embodiment Sakuya insults her when she's not there, saying something like "Oh, that girl fell asleep again! Idiot!". I'm probably wrong as I've never gotten up to Sakuya, but that's what I've heard on forums and from other fans. ~~Takoto 08:33, October 21, 2009 (UTC)
It's wrong : if you read the dialogues of different stories in Embodiment Of Scarlet Devil: translation, you could notice that there's not such words in Sakuya's dialogue with Reimu or Marisa. Also, don't forget that the lazyness of Meiling is entirely fanon, and that Sakuya takes care about Meiling's security in Strange and Bright Nature Deity. Anonymous 21:43, August 03 2010 (TTC)
The laziness is semi-canon, but probably not to the exagerated extent that fanon portrays it. It's implied in both BAiJR and her Perfect Memento article that she sometimes sleeps on the job (The joke in Perfect Memento being that Akyu doesn't realize it's Mei Ling dozing off on the job) and of course, in Touhou Hisoutenko she dreamed the whole thing while sleeping on the job.. Meanwhile, in terms of Sakuya and Mei Ling's relationship, it's generally portrayed as "stern but fair" (and overall caring). The one who's particularly mean to Mei Ling actually seems to be Patchouli, but then again, Patchouli often gets snarky even with Sakuya so that's to be expected and she still acknowledges they need a door guard in Mei Ling's ending, showing she probably cares about Mei Ling too.

TiamatRoar 13:50, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

Well, the fact that she falls asleep during her ending in Hisoutensoku tends to be a "troll" from ZUN about the Meiling of the fanbase. Note that Perfect Memento says that, although she sleeps, intruders that attempt to pass will have the consequence to awake her and then she'll attack. She doesn't have problems to guard the door, because, as said in Perfect Memento again, she doesn't have real weak points. Note that her mistress likes to look at her battles against intruders from time to time.

GoldNoway 14:38, April 7, 2011 (TTC)

"Even ZUN himself said that he doesn't deny calling her "China"[edit]

Source of this, please? Not that I don't believe it, I just want my reference. Universalperson 02:03, October 21, 2009 (UTC)

Possible source, which I can now prepare, is a talk event in 2004, and her phrase "Geez, please remember my name~" in IaMP. I think the former shows that ZUN knew the nickname "China" used so often and accepted the joke "Hmm, who is she?", which means accurately that he hasn't put her position on some importance related to storyline. And the latter is ZUN didn't care about her situation because that game was to be supervised by him.
So it's OK to say ZUN acknowledges that Meiling jokes doesn't contradict to official settings (e.g. he doesn't neither hate nor love the jokes), but it's suspectable he admits that she might be called "China" correctly... But the fact is almost all Touhou fans of Japan believe that ZUN announced they can call her so officially.
This is the line in Question:
 ―『ZUNさんにとって、紅魔館の門番である中国の本名は既に黒歴史ですか   (エツセン 22歳)』
ZUN:
同じような質問が多いねぇ。そうだねぇ……まぁ……だれだったっけ?(会場笑)大体ねぇ、1面とか3面とか4面とかはねーあんまり覚えていないんで。さすがに強いキャラは出せない。
だから……なんていうの。結局3面のボスぐらいが一番「いい」奴なんだよね。
Automatic translator roughly confirms this is right. !8RstuPId2Y 12:44, June 19, 2010 (UTC)

About the Green Dragon Blade[edit]

It's possible that Youmu might not be refering the Green Dragon Blade used by Guan Yu, but is in fact talking about another weapon that is similar to the Chinese Dao. In the light novel series Yoshinaga-san-chi no Gargoyle, one character, Takahara Iyo is frequently mentioned to wield a Green Dragon Blade that has been shown to be Dao-like weapon. I wonder if, for this case, this is in fact the weapon in question.

The 虹 Characters[edit]

I don't know any languages other than english, but when I googled 虹 it sent me to the Japanese wikipedia article about rainbows. The article says it means a type of dragon, but does it also have some connection to her rainbow-themed spell cards?

Wouldn't be surprised if it did. - Kiefmaster99 17:31, 16 May 2012 (UTC)
Look at Chapter 15 of Curiosities of Lotus Asia: >"One more thing, as proof that dragons run through the three “ama” there are the rainbows that cross the sky. The ones that appear after a storm are the traces of a dragon’s appearance." And I recall somewhere in SWR, Reimu mentioned something similar.
Also in the Japanese Wikipedia it says "In the Chinese language, there are many custom that regard rainbows as a type of dragon or snake". On a side note, not really related to Meiling (more of Flan), but "starbow" is written as 星 (lit. star-rainbow) in Japanese.--Doncot (talk) 08:39, 11 July 2012 (UTC)

"She is known to sleep on the job."[edit]

Is this actual canon? It seems that the joke of her falling asleep while guarding the SDM is completely perpetuated by fanon, in case it isn't, could someone point me towards a few references? Belone (talk) 19:07, 10 January 2022 (UTC)

In Hisoutensoku Sakuya found her asleep outside and thought she was attacked. In PMiSS a witness said they saw her asleep when passing in front of the SDM. There might be something else but i don't remember. PK (talk) 21:15, 10 January 2022 (UTC)