• Welcome to Touhou Wiki!
  • Registering is temporarily disabled. Check in our Discord server to request an account and for assistance of any kind.

Talk:Touhou Wiki: Difference between revisions

From Touhou Wiki
Jump to navigation Jump to search
mNo edit summary
Line 415: Line 415:
:I would assume neither themes had english titles and consequently an american and someone-not-american (british, canadian, ... ) translated it as such, and therefore now you have two versions of "colored". --[[User:Tsukihime|Tsukihime]] 06:39, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
:I would assume neither themes had english titles and consequently an american and someone-not-american (british, canadian, ... ) translated it as such, and therefore now you have two versions of "colored". --[[User:Tsukihime|Tsukihime]] 06:39, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
:Well, that sounds logical. One thing I want to say with this is that such spelling "errors" doesn't need to be changed, otherwise those two themes should get changed too. ☢ [[User:Quwanti|Quwanti]] 22:41, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
:Well, that sounds logical. One thing I want to say with this is that such spelling "errors" doesn't need to be changed, otherwise those two themes should get changed too. ☢ [[User:Quwanti|Quwanti]] 22:41, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
::It's a minor detail. I'm sure anyone would associate "color" and "colour" with the same concept. Of course, my spellchecker is telling me that the correct spelling is "color" but I'm ignoring it --[[User:Tsukihime|Tsukihime]] 01:56, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

Revision as of 01:56, 11 November 2011

Workspace

Discussions



Character Page Sections

I'm using the Reimu page as a baseline along with the new InfoBox layout.

Right now, the sections are divided like this;

Main Description
(Contents Box here)
1 Concept
1.1 Name
1.2 Appearance
1.3 Occupation
1.4 Relationships
2 Story
3 Additional Info
3.1 Trivia
3.2 Fandom
4 Spell Cards
5 Official Profiles
6 Official Sources

Currently, I'm thinking of chopping out section 1.3 and merging it with the Main Description. I think that the first few paragraphs of the page should describe the character briefly, its personality and the character's status quo(Ex. Reimu is a shrine maiden who solves incidents). I find that very hard to do without repeating myself in the occupations section. The InfoBox also has a occupations section.

Also, I don't think that 1.4 fits well in "Concept". Relationships are not part of the character's concept; the name is, the appearance is, but not the relationships. Should we put this section somewhere else?

Many other pages are like this and currently the model for the InfoBox layout is like this. Should we change/standardize it?

Sefam 04:10, 9 August 2011 (UTC)

I feel that 1.4 would allow to see how the relationships evolve over time if it's under story. ♥★♦ 16:04, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Note that "concept" is all optional. If some information is too short and fits better in the intro that is good, I guess. And other optional subheadings are fine too, like for the ability. And subsubheadings could be used too (Refering to Yukari Yakumo). ~ Quwanti (Talk) 16:08, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Right, I understand that. For example, not all characters have a special occupation(Rin) or notable ability that has to be explained (Yuugi) It was more along the lines that the information, if they did have that stuff, should be presented the same way in the same places if they are there.

This is what I'm thinking...

(These borrow elements from Sefam and UTW and one other person I'm forgetting. Sorry.)

Main Description

A short Summary of Character on top of Contents box

(Contents Box here)
1 Concept
1.1 Name
1.2 Appearance
1.3 (Personality)
1.4 (Some other thing) *Optional
2 Story (with links to their dialogue)
2.1 BackStory *Maybe Optional... (Reason being I'm not sure if all characters do have a backstory)
2.2 Relationships
3 Additional Info
3.1 Trivia
3.2 Fandom
3.3 (Some other thing that doesn't fit under these two) *Optional
(Other notable thing goes here) *Optional
4 Spell Cards
5 Official Profiles
6 Official Source

(The top is subject to change)

What I find missing often is a summary on top of the profile, dialogue, appearance is missing, things like that. So, tell me what you think! ♥★♦ 16:41, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Yes, something like that, plus a maybe reference (youtube for example). But I think relationships should be part of "concept". ~ Quwanti (Talk) 19:10, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Sorry, too many pages to keep track of and I thought things were finally settled on. One, I suggested the optional Personality under Concept, in case that ever needs more elaboration than what's touched on in the opening summary.

Two, I don't believe Relationships makes much sense under "Concept", which along with what Nazeo said, implies to me that it should be used mostly for the bare bones of a character. I wonder if this is too rigid a thought. Obviously the other option is to forget this very literal definition, cram it all under Concept again and leave Story for that alone, especially since Story is so lengthy for some characters.

Also, thinking about the way I laid out some articles like Mononobe no Futo or Toyosatomimi no Miko when adding the historical/fictional/mythological basis, I realized Name and these descriptions usually go hand in hand in most articles, so I thought Name should be renamed Name and Basis or something (when Basis information is available, anyway).UTW 04:13, 28 August 2011 (UTC)

Don't be sorry, I'm just making sure that the work on these don't conflict later. (Also, while I agree with what you said about the relationships. it was User:Sefam who stated that, not me, lol) I looked at your work and I agree with the set-up, (though I added Relationships as a later thing) For Basis, it translates back as concept, so I think that'll work for now unless it's like Rin who's occupation may have a reference to Buddhism and makes the character (which would be optional because other characters may or may not have have notable qualities like that in regards to Concept)

Sorry Quwanti, but IMO, relationships make more sense to me in the story section. Your reference ideas if they have a basis in history can be a subsection under Trivia but on top of Fandom.

What worries me is the position of the Backstory section. If it's on top, 1.it can possibly spoil the story, but if it's under it, 2. it may repeat what the story already stated (though a simple fix may correct that 3. is that it shouldn't be a sub and be italicized and crammed somehere) So far, I'm with # 2, anyone else has their own spin on this? ♥★♦ 21:58, 28 August 2011 (UTC)

Character infobox lists

> Mima. Tony did an revision ([1]) with using "small" for text between the brackets for specifing the stage and stuff. It looks ok imo, though, for that a template should be created so a page isn's spammed with all "<small>" and <br /> stuff. ☢ Quwanti (dutch) 16:41, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

I did this simply because of lack of space. I'm trying to find way reduce space without harm and is why I suggested 350. I don't know any other methods apart from <small>. Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 16:56, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

May I add the lyrics to some songs?

Just got a copy of Funny Party in the Fog, and was going to add some of the lyrics, but then I saw the line that says "Do not submit copyrighted work without permission!" So this is me asking permission to add the lyrics for some of the songs. I'm sure they're copyrighted somewhere, so I thought it would be safer to ask. --Flanchan 01:12, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Adding the lyrics for songs is fine for as long as you don't just copy and paste other people's translations without crediting them. Master Bigode 02:45, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Heaven within the Youkai mountain?

I believe there should be a location category called "Worlds Above" (天空) in the "outside Gensokyou" section. The "underworld" has its own category, so I suppose there should be a category for everything above gensokyo as well. The netherworld/hakugyukuro/heaven could be moved to this section (I'm not sure if the netherworld required its own category...The Hakugyokuro could even be a subcategory within the "netherworld" page). I would also add in the senkai (仙界) there, which is where the bosses of th13 moved over to after leaving the mausoleum beneath Myouren temple. Maybe even the "Dragon Palace" (竜宮) in the thunderstorm clouds as well...though i'm not sure if there's enough facts for it to have a page of its own.

Heaven and the Youkai mountain isn't literally connected by a road. It's more like a summit where the open passage through the clouds above are visible. Right now according to the wiki, it looks as if the Yama sends you to the youkai mountain once you reach ascension... Tren 03:07, 19 August 2011 (UTC)


Cirno Tokens

On The List Of Users page, you can earn the much acclaimed Cirno Tokens in which you can wear proudly here.

For every 9 major contributions you make to wiki, you receive a wonderful cirno token!

You may exchange 9 cirno tokens for a cirno coin.

Each task on the community portal should be assigned a reward value between 1 and 5. This indicates how many cirno tokens you will receive upon completion of the task. 5 cirno tokens means you will receive a cirno coin.

You can find these point values on The List Of Users page.

After you complete the task, award yourself the number of tokens assigned!

I'm just the lowly messenger. :3

Any questions please direct them to Tsukihime or Nazeo (though it's preferred to talk to Tsukihime before coming to me)

♥★♦ 16:15, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Stubs

Now the "stub" template isn't very clear. Yes, the page isn't fully finished and defenitly needs revision, but I think the "stub" template could be expanded for a bit. So having different kinds of stubs, "Translation stubs", "Character stubs", "Game stubs" etc. My idea is that when you do something like

{{Stub|Game|(list of stuff that needs to be done)}}

The first "Game" will be categorized as "[[Category:Game stubs]]

And the template will show a very small box with small text, and using the <toggledisplay> to show and hide the small list of tasks. And in the middle "This article about a game is a stub. If you can add to it in any way, please do so."

Sure, it could be put on the community portal, but it is useless to put every stub there. And for things like fangames it could be usefill.   ☢ Quwanti (Talk) 00:07, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Fan doujins by character?

I figured I would get some input before starting this. I figured that there are a lot of Touhou Doujins out there with alot of characters...I figured maybe we can put up a page and list the doujins on the character by appearance?

We don't have to go around digging for them...it's something to add to when we come across them. MaronaPossessed 21:13, 11 September 2011 (UTC)

Incomplete Translations

There are plenty of pages for songs or literature that haven't been translated into English. Cage in Lunatic Runagate's seventh chapter is nearly entirely blank, the eighth chapter is also incomplete and the afterword has no English at all. That's just one example. I was wondering who has the knowledge to translate these sorts of things, as the pages seem very half-done without them. DarkMarxSoul 00:03, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,10102.60.html Good luck there... Berzul 00:06, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

"Fake" games

I was just looking at fan-made_characters/Rinbokusan_Sasaki and it says she was made for a "fake" touhou game.

What is a "Fake" game? Perhaps a more descriptive term could be used to describe such games? I certainly wouldn't want players calling any games I create "fake" --Tsukihime 19:25, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

It's a game that pretends to be an official game by ZUN. Master Bigode 19:44, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
The fake term is pretty much something inaccurate to describe such games... I don't know if it is refering to that it is a "fake" Touhou game or a "Fake" game, just... leave them as Touhou "clones" if anything... Berzul 20:11, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

Pool Touhou Wiki?

What is this? What's it going to be? I discovered it when I tried to upload a new image... Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 18:11, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Just change pool. to en. --Hikaruxz 19:42, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

OK. Thanks for the info ^^ Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 21:39, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Game Navbox restructuring

I've been considering the (official) game navboxes, and I think we can organize them far better than they are right now.

My biggest concern at the moment is that we have a page/subpage structure named "translation". This is, in my opinion, a rather useless structure. The translation page itself is hardly even useful, and the most I've seen it do is link to the scenario pages. Nothing the navbox can't do, in any case. As for its use as a header, I'm pretty sure everyone who comes here expects to see a translation anyway, regardless of whether the header labels it explicitly or not. I think we can safely do away with it.

And so, in its place, I thought it would be far better to unify the groups under the headers "story", "gameplay" and "documentation" for most games. Prologue/extra story, scenario/extra scripts, characters and locations all belong under the Story subsection. Strategy and spellcards belong under Gameplay, and Documentation is for anything else within the game files, like the music comments and afterword. Not all games navboxes will look the same, of course, but I mean as a general guideline. Games like Shoot the Bullet that lack a story as such would retain the Translation structure for instance.

Some examples:

(Ten Desires one implemented)


Are there any major objections to doing this? And I mean beyond the amount of work :P If it comes down to it I can handle the worst of it. --Mizutori 23:35, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

I absolotly, and I mean seriously thinking about it, I absolotly have no objection to this :P It looks perfecly fine to me cause I was thinking the same thing before I seen the abouve you wrote. I'd say go ahead and do those useful edits :D Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 00:04, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes, yes yes yes yes yes yes. Please, and thank you. I've hated "Translation" ever since we started the subpage setup and the navboxes as they are. If you can combine the sections in a way that makes it logical and easier to navigate, that'd be awesome. Don't forget to move the pages around too, to their proper subpage sections. Momiji 05:12, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

So..... Momiji is planning to do away the "Translation" subpage.... hmm... Story under "Story" subpage is it? - KyoriAsh 05:32, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
It would make sense, although having "Translation" in the first place was the result of the original translation of the raw text. I always thought that having the majority of the game text, story and whatnot, being under "Translation" felt awkward and kind've inappropriate. Momiji 05:40, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
Planned, next week to do the moving, with interwiki link fix - KyoriAsh 06:09, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
Great! Good to hear I wasn't the only "Translation" hater. :V For the subpages, I thought Game/Story/Prologue, Game/Story/Scenario, Game/Story/Characters etc etc was the best structure. I don't necessarily think we should move stuff like Spell Cards under the Gameplay subpage though, just like we don't have Music under Documentation, so it'd just be the story stuff that gets moved around.
But by planned for next week, do you mean only the moving? I could reorganize the navboxes for now. --Mizutori 10:39, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

What to do with the Translation page for like UFO where there are other documentation on it? ☢ Quwanti 14:25, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

We could rename those to "Miscellaneous Translations" (or something) and stick them under documentation, perhaps? --Mizutori 15:55, 25 September 2011 (UTC)


Alright, I'll be starting on the Ten Desires navbox and subpages move now. --Mizutori 11:52, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

I did say we start this weekend? - KyoriAsh 12:17, 27 September 2011 (UTC)
You said next week so I wasn't sure... ^^; But Ten Desires internal stuff is done, so all that's left is stuff that links to redirects, which I'll take care of now too. --Mizutori 12:24, 27 September 2011 (UTC)
Ah, so the "Translation" subpage will exist. Ok then those miscellaneous translations could be put in there. ☢ Quwanti 12:27, 27 September 2011 (UTC)
Aye, and we can put it on the documentation line in the navbox. But for now the Ten Desires translation page is really useless so I didn't put it (yet?). --Mizutori 12:40, 27 September 2011 (UTC)
I see. I will move those "miscaleanneous translations" to that page. ☢ Quwanti 12:43, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Internal link fix: done, Interwiki link fix: done, useless redirect delete: done - KyoriAsh 12:48, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

It looks okay to me and I think it could be done with the other game pages. Unless we are waiting for something? ☢ Quwanti 12:43, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Yes I'm waiting marked for move to avoid the useless redirect - KyoriAsh 13:06, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
I want to do Touhou Hisoutensoku, but I am not fully sure about some stuff.

I cant place the versus dialogue anywhere then there. ☢ Quwanti 14:53, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

What's wrong with it been under gameplay? Should it be somewhere else? Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 15:06, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
There is possible, seems logic. Though, I am not going to add it immediately. Waiting for more opinions. ☢ Quwanti 15:37, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
Another thing I am not sure about is the subpages. Obviously the story scenarios goes under story, and some goes for the prologue. But what about the versus dialogue script? Still note sure to put those under gameplay. ☢ Quwanti 13:32, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
Should be under Story, since mostly dialogues related to story, although only versus dialog. - KyoriAsh 15:25, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
I see, it seems okay if it is there. ☢ Quwanti 21:08, 27 October 2011 (UTC)
Maybe adding a "terms" at the story, where stuff like "divine spirits" and "Taoism" could go at Ten Desires, for example. ☢ Quwanti 21:08, 27 October 2011 (UTC)

Official speculation

Saw this term. What makes speculation official? When ZUN goes "Hmm yes that may be the case I guess though I never explicitly wrote that"? --Tsukihime 05:44, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Dunno that it was even used. Given that the term "official" is related to ZUN, if ZUN says something about his work then it's fact, not a speculation. Why would he make speculations on his own work? Deathsoul4 05:48, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
On second thought maybe the person using the term mistook "fan speculation" or downright his/her own speculation for that. Deathsoul4 05:49, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
[2] It was in-universe speculation, taken from PMiSS. Morrolan 06:06, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
Yea, it's in-universe speculation. Sorry, I thought that was clear from the context. That said, ZUN does speculate on his own things every once in a while (many characters' official profiles include the words "Probably", etc), but normally as a joke or for small stuff that falls under the "Shrug of God" category. TiamatRoar 14:01, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Deleting old talks

So how did Darkslime get away with this one? :/ Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 16:02, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Voting for de link change

The current de address: http://de.touhouwiki.net/

The "new" de address: http://wiki.touhou-forum.de/

Please give some suggestion and opinion regarding existing de wiki, thanks. - KyoriAsh 12:10, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

Their front page is not up to date like ours is all I'm saying. Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 12:17, 9 October 2011 (UTC)
Their front page not necessary update as en, the same as zh and ru also using different main page compared to en - KyoriAsh 12:37, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

How will it affect the curent de interwikis? I think if it relieves some server stress it's good to have them host it on their forum server. Mizutori 12:28, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

Rest assure, interwiki link won't affected much - KyoriAsh 12:37, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

A sitenotice has been put up in current de wiki. - KyoriAsh 13:09, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

I'm ok with the link change. -Master Bigode 16:40, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

Ditto. It does not affect interwiki links Deathsoul4 18:17, 9 October 2011 (UTC)
It'll act in much the same way as the French Touhou Wiki. I don't see the problem with that, so long as the users of the .de wiki are in favour of it. - Kiefmaster99 18:19, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

It's already in the process, I'm just waiting for K to update the mainpage to change stuff. Momiji 19:51, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

Feedback on the red section ying-yangs.

Just a little head up concerning the new red ying-yangs preceding section headers now.

I like them, they add a layer of style to the wiki, but I think the red is a bit too much. On my monitor, it really clashes with the mix of black(text), white(background) and blue/purple(hyperlinks). It could use a bit of a tone down in color. What does everyone else think? Also, they don't seem to be vertically centered with the text, is that intended?

--Sefam 16:06, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

I think it's awesome just the way it is :D MaronaPossessed 17:03, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
A deeper color of red could be fine as well, but I'm fine with the way it is right now. Deathsoul4 17:47, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
I also believe they're too bright. --WGH 17:31, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
I to think the red is a bit too much. Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 18:53, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
Concur. - Kiefmaster99 19:29, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
I have actually been thinking of changing the yin-yangs to a blue color to match the theme better, especially given that we made the underline for h2s dark blue. How does this look? http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3115610/blueicons.png Darkslime 14:20, 24 October 2011 (UTC)
Actually, that does look much better than black-white and red-white. I say go for it. Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 14:23, 24 October 2011 (UTC)
I think that blue is a little to deep. It can be a slightly more softer blue so it is more light blue, or adding more gray and white so it is a little lighter. ☢ Quwanti 14:58, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

I like the blue myself. Reason being as Darkslime said, it does indeed match the theme better. If we made skins in the far future, then this would be a great idea to have different colored orbs, but that is a different matter entirely... As for the shade, I'm indifferent to it. ♥★♦ 20:32, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

Wiki pages and English patches

Game transcripts and spellcard names from the wiki (and maybe some other things, like character titles) often don't correspond to actual in-game text from English patches. Is it a problem (and should be fixed), or not?
OneMore 15:07, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

"Just because a translation appears in a game patch does not make it 100% correct. Translations do change and become more accurate over time. Games may also have inherent limitations such as maximum length." So it means that it should stay at it is now, unless someone does have another opinion on certain translations. ☢ Quwanti 15:13, 24 October 2011 (UTC)
Yeah, translations are always getting better, especially around here. The amount of errors/oversights I find in translations that are put up soon after a game comes out is rather staggering, but I don't have enough time to really go over them. Also, the EoSD translation is so outdated that it could actually use a whole new english patch at this point. Darkslime 02:08, 25 October 2011 (UTC)
Okay. OneMore 08:02, 25 October 2011 (UTC)
Are the translation patches done by a single circle or are they made by several different people from all over? If it is made by a single person, I could contact him/her to help out with updated translation. Tren 18:15, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
Some of them are by a single person, but some haven't been active for a long while and is why most of the patches haven't been updated to this wiki's standards... Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 19:03, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
Obviously not by one single person. As far as I know some people from Gensokyo.org make the translation patch, with translation from this wiki. ☢ Quwanti 19:43, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
Hmm... The ones I suspect were by a single person are HRtP, SoEW, EoSD, PCB and IN. I could be wrong, so I don't want to get into a little argument lol :) Tony64 (Talk/Con.) 20:34, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

Colors/Colours

I am a little confused about some stuff. A while ago, Nazeo did some spellcheck edits and part of that was changing "Colour" to "color" (http://en.touhouwiki.net/index.php?title=Undefined_Fantastic_Object/Gameplay&diff=prev&oldid=228676). Now the edits aren't bad or something, but something came to my mind.

Two of Marisa's themes, "Love-Coloured Magic" and "Love-colored Master Spark". Both has "love-colo(u)red" in it's name, but why does both have different spellings? ☢ Quwanti 21:20, 9 November 2011 (UTC)

I would assume neither themes had english titles and consequently an american and someone-not-american (british, canadian, ... ) translated it as such, and therefore now you have two versions of "colored". --Tsukihime 06:39, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
Well, that sounds logical. One thing I want to say with this is that such spelling "errors" doesn't need to be changed, otherwise those two themes should get changed too. ☢ Quwanti 22:41, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
It's a minor detail. I'm sure anyone would associate "color" and "colour" with the same concept. Of course, my spellchecker is telling me that the correct spelling is "color" but I'm ignoring it --Tsukihime 01:56, 11 November 2011 (UTC)