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IMO, we should just link to [[other games]] instead of linking to the list of fangames and every seihou game in the front page. [[User:Master Bigode|Master Bigode]] 00:45, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
IMO, we should just link to [[other games]] instead of linking to the list of fangames and every seihou game in the front page. [[User:Master Bigode|Master Bigode]] 00:45, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
:That would make sense. Only official stuff should be on the frontpage. --[[User:Tsukihime|Tsukihime]] 01:24, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
:That would make sense. Only official stuff should be on the frontpage. --[[User:Tsukihime|Tsukihime]] 01:24, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
Isn't the series of Three Mischievous Fairies manga called Touhou Sangetsusei, not Touhou Sangessei? -- [[User:SuddenFrost|SuddenFrost]] 07:20, 20 February 2011 (UTC)


== Fan animations ==
== Fan animations ==


So recently I was going through youtube and watching random touhou animations and figured maybe we should have some pages with links to them as well! --[[User:Tsukihime|Tsukihime]] 01:17, 20 February 2011 (UTC)
So recently I was going through youtube and watching random touhou animations and figured maybe we should have some pages with links to them as well! --[[User:Tsukihime|Tsukihime]] 01:17, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

Revision as of 07:20, 20 February 2011

Discussions

Archives: 0 1 2


New guidelines page

I'm constructing a new editing guidelines page here, which aims to be the definitive source on standards and such for the wiki. Help and suggestions would be greatly appreciated! It would probably be better to discuss things of those topics there, as well. Darkslime 20:24, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps policies and copyrights should be merged into this. This would save on two extra pages. Some of these guidelines would need to be updated as we are no longer hosted by Wikia. Condensing some of the rules would help. Kiefmaster99 20:38, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
Touhou_Wiki:Policy -> Touhou_Wiki:Privacy_policy and Touhou_Wiki:Copyrights -> Touhou_Wiki:Disclaimers? (as the link are available at the bottom of the page - KyoriAsh 20:51, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
Agreed. It would be nice if we could replace Touhou Wiki:General disclaimer, Touhou Wiki:About, and Touhou Wiki:Privacy policy with more useful pages. Pufferfish101 00:57, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
Don't forget Hepburn romanization (sya > sha, ti > chi, zi > ji, si > shi, etc.). Momiji 21:16, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
There's nothing saying you all can't help, too, lol. Darkslime 15:45, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
But I like sitting back and watching everyone else do the work. ^.~ Just kidding. Momiji 19:20, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
I didn't know there was a name for the set of romaji that we use. Well, that explains why japanese sites use "sya" instead of "sha". Though, I've never actually seen "zi" before. --Tsukihime 16:58, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

English patches for official games

The page is in a bit of a shambles. The patches for PCB are completely missing. The patch for EoSD leads to version 0.8 from 2007, and I'm not sure if there is a newer version. Could someone who has good knowledge of the English patching scene make sure that all the English patch links on the wiki (for the official games) are up to date with the newest version and valid? Also, if there are no English patches for games 3-5, perhaps a notice could be put on the page? Some other notes: Phantasmagoria of Flower View/English Patch doesn't seem to contain any useful information, and I'm not sure what Phantasmagoria of Flower View: In-game images to translate and Category:Phantasmagoria of Flower View Translation Screens are up to. Also, the weather patch should include a description of what the weather patch is. That is, if the weather patch wasn't rendered obsolete by the full patch, in which case it should be removed. Anybody familiar with the patches? Pufferfish101 00:53, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

Is it unacceptable for me to find offsite patches (I'll make sure they are safe, I swear!)
Because I'm not familiar with patching to begin with, but I do want to help!
Nazeo 19:37, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
Sure, as long as it's the right version and it works properly with the games. Pufferfish101 05:49, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
If the weather patch here was the same one from wikia (oh noez!) then it isn't completely obsolete but it's unneccessary. I remember this patching telling the player outright how the weather affects gameplay and the full patch just hints at what the weather does. But to be honest, it really isn't that hard to figure out given the hint.
~jaxter0987~ 10:12, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Unifying Spell Card Info template

Currently there are 5 spell card info template available:

Right now I'm try to unifying these 5 template into one with a parameter to call, Sample can be view here and the related template can be view here. Feel free to discuss about this template - KyoriAsh 23:18, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

New template partial implemented - KyoriAsh 06:01, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
Looks nice. Are you going to be unifying the fighter card templates as well? Pufferfish101 06:08, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
Yep, in planning as I want to find the common parameter between other 3 templates - KyoriAsh 06:24, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
Template for Skill Card or Spell Card for Fighter game has completed, now the Spell Card Info template is 5 in 1 - KyoriAsh 05:45, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Getting the word out!

Since the old wiki isn't playing nice, I (Nazeo) will get the word out on every community that is interested someway, somehow!

My buddy, User:Pufferfish101 gave me the idea when I changed the links in knowyourmeme!

Wish me luck, and I'll be listing the sites I've got the word out to!

Sites I've covered


Knowyourmeme Links to us!
Vocaloidotaku Mentioned to the references they make to us.
Gensokyo Thank Momiji for this one!
Squiby One day, we shall have Touhou Pets on this wiki!
Youtube Yeah, that's right. I'm making comments to ALL the vids (as Thelarrman) to be sure they credit us!
Doujinstyle They are some curious people!
I mean, a bunch of people already combed the internet for links way back when when the move was first happening (TvTropes, random wikis, etc.) but I just rechecked the other day to see if they missed anything relatively big (inevitable, since there are so many links). Don't bother with the obscure ones - a lot of the links are in places where they can't be changed, but if you come across any other high traffic sites like the above still linking to the old wiki, then yeah, feel free to spread the word. Good luck! Pufferfish101 05:54, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

Updating your subpages

Please update your articles so that any related articles are properly nested as a subpage. All subpage articles should follow the main article, followed by a slash, followed by the article name.

For example, Youkai Tan Q Roku/Items

Where Youkai Tan Q Roku is the main article and Youkai Tan Q Roku/Items is a subpage. You can see that the Items article contains a link back to the parent page. More information on subpages can be found here

Any future sub-articles to an article should be created with this structure. Possible applications include, but not limited to:

  • Games (gameplay, translation, etc.)
  • Print works (chapter 1, chapter 2, etc.)
  • Conventions (specific conventions would be a subpage to the main conventions page, which will be created later)

I personally would prefer updating the main article to link to the new subpage directly as opposed to using the re-direct, but that is up to you. Some problems I see with the appearance is the page title. It will contain the entire name you see in the URL. This can be quite ugly. I have moved different types of pages like a translation article for a game. We can see that as I decided to structure it as such, the page title is really long. Perhaps there is a way to make it so the page title will only show the last part of the URL? Or maybe we can define our own custom page titles.

This will be the solution to removing all of the existing "Return to" links. --Tsukihime 14:33, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

I am not 100% sure, but it's probably best if we use [[/subpage_name| ]] to link to the subpages. That way, if we decided to move the main article (and consequently all of the subpages), the links would not depend on the base name. Maybe someone can verify --Tsukihime 05:42, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
Tsukihime, verfied. The [[/subpage_name]] link works - KyoriAsh 06:42, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
Second that, and I would add that it's much easier to type. Pufferfish101 06:54, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
Btw, remember that if you just type [/name] the / will still be there lol --Tsukihime 14:42, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Subpage Link Example:

VIEW THE SOURCE CODE PLEASE - KyoriAsh 07:46, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Re-structuring Articles

We should probably consider re-structuring pages if necessary before actually moving them. Of course, many have already been doing that (ie: placing individual spell card pages under the main spell card article, etc) but I've found that the number of layers that I've been making is getting a little high (ie: sub-sub-sub-subpages) because I've been using the "Return to" links as a guide.

For example, in most Games, we have the main article, and then sections for Gameplay, Translation, Maps, and Music. Preferably, I would like subpages to be at most 2 layers deep (sub-subpages), as attempting to link to it from outside of the main article would be pretty crazy!

Some articles would definitely need some thought put into it --Tsukihime 14:12, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Uploads of (official) printworks / piracy in general

Doujin Circles

We should make a really big deal with this. Like, a huge deal. So I have come up with some categories so far:

  • Doujin Circle/Game (for games)
  • Doujin Circle/Arrange (for music)
  • Doujin Circle/Print (print works I suppose?)
  • ...and maybe more

We'll have a main Doujin Circle page. It will be a master list of all doujin circles throughout the wiki, which is about 1000. This means we'll have to start categorizing groups appropriately.

Every doujin circle will have their own page. Their page will serve as some general profile along with all of their works that they've released.

We'll have a conventions page that will list all of the conventions (as opposed to the conventions category) and each convention will have its own page as a subpage under this (ie: Conventions/Comiket 79). There could be several installments, and we have one of the "summary" pages (ie: Reitaisai) so I'm not too sure how this might be structured. Conventions/Comiket/Comiket 79 perhaps?

Each convention subpage will contain information about the convention. Maybe a map if people really want to make one. Otherwise, just a list of products released during that convention.

The following main articles are proposed:

  • Conventions (master list of conventions)
  • Doujin Circles (master list of doujin circles)

All information would be structured appropriately. It would be quite unfeasible to maintain (or even create) these pages manually, so with the existing resources it doesn't really work :< --Tsukihime 15:29, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

One other possible category that I would propose is having another category for animations (possibly include flash?) and whatever category M-1 skits would fall into. I take it that these categories are not mutually exclusive. With regards to Comiket information, I'm not sure if map information is essential, since I don't see any use for it after the convention ends (maybe someone else does?). Basic statistics (such as how many participating circles) would be nice. Kiefmaster99 23:11, 12 January 2011 (UTC)
Flash would be a good addition. I think there are more and more video/flash works coming out and are pretty well-done. They definitely should have their own category --Tsukihime 19:52, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

Some Video

  • Update: Thanks to NamelessLegacy lending his talents for making my video into a jamming masterpiece!

I also made the video a little easier on the eyes!

External Link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEBIryH7zkM

♥★♦ 03:36, 12 January 2011 (UTC)


Ehehe, good stuff there. Might as well spread the word out to everywhere else. Deathsoul4 03:49, 12 January 2011 (UTC)


Looked great. I'm being a bit nit picky here but the "Hello" is a little hard to read in that color. And yeah we should spread the word everywhere else.
~jaxter0987~ 10:12, 12 January 2011 (UTC)
Please don't embed that into the Talk page, thanks. Momiji 04:55, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Regarding some redirect pages

I see that some redirect pages have recently been deleted. Well, as we are moving most of the "Main page: Subpage" stuff to "Main page/Subpage", can't we delete the "Main page: Subpage" if we can? Deathsoul4 05:10, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

I was on a crusade with deleting re-directs, but then others on IRC mentioned that external websites may be using some of those links. I personally don't see a problem with it, but I was convinced that it makes no real difference in the end so I just didn't bother deleting them. I mean, I can move pages without even creating redirects, but for the convenience of some arbitrary user out there, it probably isn't too bad to keep a re-direct. --Tsukihime 19:41, 15 January 2011 (UTC)
Gotcha. I was thinking that keeping them might only take up space... But I see what you mean. Deathsoul4 19:50, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

New talk page structure

I've made an attempt to organize how discussions take place. Anything that requires discussion (ie: adding a new feature, organizing content, etc.) should probably have their own page for it. It is also easier to see what kind of things we've discussed --Tsukihime 17:08, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

You mean something like Talk: Touhou Wiki/Fandom, Talk: Touhou Wiki/Yukari Yakumo, and Talk: Touhou Wiki/How to use a bomb under the discussion page, and probably the talk page should kind of look like this:
==blah blah blah==
(previous discussion materials)
==blah blah blah blah==
(matters not that important so as to make a separate discussion page--e.g. sth like popularity votes or sth)
==Discussions==
[[/Fandom]]
[[/Yukari Yakumo]]
[[/How to use a bomb]]
Good idea if the discussion topic is something that would take up a lot of spaces. Sry for taking up too much space! ;) Deathsoul4 21:12, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

DISAGREE

Talk Page should not have subpage, and please archive the topic if it is too long - KyoriAsh 12:12, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

The current archive is rather useless. If you're looking for a topic, you have to go to each archive one by one to see if such a discussion took place. The sort of discussions we have are more meaningful if you organize by topic rather than date. You're not required to make a subpage. However, don't be surprised if a really heated topic gets subpaged rather than shown on the front! --Tsukihime 20:53, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Regarding My Nuking of Wikia Refferences

Before anyone "follows my example" by nuking the rest of the references to wikia. I've been following the following criteria: Userpages and talk pages is off limits unless it was painfully obvious that the person in question intended to link to the new link(mostly revision logs and diffs) or the user in question was a wikia bot.

Also someone should probably take a look at the help pages and add the delete template to pages that no longer make any sense or redirect people to the Wikipedia equivalent.--Umhyuk 06:07, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

The User Project

Here's the summary...

A grand Project has taken place!

Add yourself, and put a field (or fields) you wish to be under, or make one yourself if you feel the need!

Or don't, it's your wiki, and the only thing I'll be doing is adding names.

You decide if you want to add yourself in the field or description, I'm not touching that!

Why I'm doing this?

This makes things more accessible rather than the Special Pages.

Now we can see which things need to be done and what are people are capable of!

Look and see, perhaps you have been added already!

If you feel there is a project that must be put to the attention of other members, then do so!

Any questions, and just ask!

Also, feel free to give me suggestions, and the like!

It's your wiki!

List Of Users On Touhou Wiki

Currant questions I have for the community:

Should I have siggys as a box in the community's table?


Currant Q/A the community has for me

Q:

If I add myself in a field, such as an album or tool hacker, what stops me from getting spam requests saying "MAKE ME THIS NOWZ!

A:

Well, first off, you don't have to add yourself in the field.
Second, I'm thinking of adding a busy meter that come in 3 strengths (Free/Moderate/Busy) so the ones that are willing to do it,will and the ones that are busy don't have to be asked.

Q

What if I remove myself from your list?

A

I really wish you wouldn't, but hey, I can't stop you.
What am I gonna do, force you?
This is a community consensus, and if you don't want it, then remove yourself; I won't hold it against ya!

Update!:The Lounge Room has been added!

The Community portal has been added as the Working Projects Table!
The Editor's Corner is also a source to see the future of this page!

♥★♦ 02:09, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Objectivity

I've been reading the official game articles and have noticed that there are some rather subjective descriptions (like "a challenging game"). Perhaps we should consider a more objective presentation? --Tsukihime 18:51, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Really, all the main game articles could use a good edit. When was the last time they were really revised? Pufferfish101 22:43, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
I've been going through them and revising minor things like grammar and removing some subjectivity as well as removing ALL external references (ie: non touhou) in the overview. Frankly I don't think it's necessary to say that EoSD is "like this other game for the sega genesis" as readers probably have no clue what that game is. Overviews should get to the point and avoid user's opinions on the matter. A separate section dedicated to what people think of the game would be for reviews.
Of course, this is only what I think a formal game description should be like. Perhaps the authors thought a bit more casual and subjective presentation would be more engaging to the audience. --Tsukihime 22:56, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
How do we describe Touhou games then?
Even on easy mode, they are harder than most games, so how do we describe that?
I am for the reviews page, though! :3

♥★♦ 23:05, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Why compare games in a game overview? There are plenty of other things that can be discussed that actually gives the user an idea what the game is like. It's up to them to decide whether it is "very similar to another game" or whether it's "extremely challenging" --Tsukihime 03:13, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
One more vote for the reviews page. We do need objectivity in descriptions about official games, but a review section can be made to describe how the game is in the players' stance. Deathsoul4 23:18, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
Agreed. After all, the fact notion that IN is probably the easiest game on Easy Mode should be somewhere on the wiki. Pufferfish101 04:13, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
Even this is debatable. For Easy Mode, I would agree with you, but from Normal Mode on I personally found it to be significantly harder than, let's say, MoF or LLS. The presence of spell practice alone does not necessarily make it easy to clear.
If we want to write about difficulty, we should elaborate a bit more on that, like "This game has many randomized spellcards, demanding quick reactions from the player" or something similar.
Don't just put any of those blunt "facts". No matter how clear it may seem to you and how much forum postings you saw which amplified your opinion. --NamelessLegacy 21:45, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
That's essentially what I meant. Info like that shouldn't be presented as "fact" (bad wording on my part), but we can say such and such is generally thought to be easy/easier than such and such for this and that reason. Anyway, even better than a wide generalization would be a reviews section that gives you a range of opinions. Pufferfish101 06:14, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Introducing Review pages

Let's push towards a Review section. Where should we put it on the page? Should it be easily noticeable? Should it be tucked away near the bottom of the page? Should it even be on the game page, or should we create a special section for it (ie: wiki/reviews) where all review pages are collected and we provide a link to it from the respective game. Let's use UFO as a sample. --Tsukihime 14:32, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Cloud tags vs Category tagging

I saw Category:Characters in Touhou Hisoutensoku, Category:Characters not in a Touhou game, category:Characters playable in a fighting game, and Category:Characters without hats and thought it was a little questioanble. If we extend this to other games wouldn't we end up with Reimu having 14 categories at the bottom which is quite messy! Especially if you want to write "Characters in Embodiment of Scarlet Devil, Characters in Imperishable Night, Characters in Phantasmagoria of Flower View, Characters in Phantasmagoria of Dimensional Dream, etc" --Tsukihime 19:50, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

I looked around for a tagging system similar to that used on danbooru (cause that would seem more appropriate than using categories), and found the concept of "Tag Clouds" which might be useful. There's this extension http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:FolkTagCloud which sounds like it'll achieve the tagging system, but it appears to be in addition to SMW, which we have not decided whether to install or not. But for the most part, I think some of the categories aren't too necessary --Tsukihime 00:02, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Category usage

So when do you guys think we should or should not create a category? For example "Female character", "Tall character", "Human character", "Short character", etc.

Should they be based on characteristics, article content, other? --Tsukihime 13:58, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

No, thanks - KyoriAsh 14:08, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
So what should they be based on, as many of the recent category edits are based on characteristics of the character in question rather than the content of the article itself. ie: Character profile for Byakuren is also categorized under "Characters in UFO" --Tsukihime 14:29, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

I think categories should be board, very broad.

Sub-categories should follow after as Article Headers, and the rest will fall in line!

♥★♦ 04:38, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Missing Files that Didn't Get Imported

So there are still a lot of missing files that haven't yet been transported. Especially Replays - a lot of them simply didn't get uploaded. It looks like most of the ones that did get transported are the ones that currently have links to them. I'm not sure if all the Images got imported, but I haven't seen that many missing image files anyway. Also, what's with this --> Category:Videos? Pufferfish101 09:35, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

I doubt that we have missing image files, but there are certainly some duplicates. Few of the RSO spell card images have duplicates, but since there are so many (and so many other files in the list of unused images) it'll be pretty hard to go through all of them. Deathsoul4 01:56, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
The duplicates have numbers before their file names, and are mostly old versions of certain files or a thumbnail. I wonder why they didn't upload properly though. Master Bigode 03:03, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
Speaking of RSO, I can't seem to access all images through a directory of some sort. Currently, 'Rumbling_Spell_Orchestra_Images' is blank. As well, I don't like the way they're currently named (Name####, as opposed to RSO####, since Name is redundant with the first two digits). Is there an easy way to either assign categories to them or change names? - Kiefmaster99 03:55, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

I had reuploaded all Replay files that has been in the World Record only, other user's replay not in my consideration, and DON'T TOUCH THOSE SPELL CARDS IMAGES, currently I'm in process of converting to standard naming scheme in between zh and en side. - KyoriAsh 06:09, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Collapsible section extension

The "Official Profile" section of some characters are getting really long, but not everyone who comes here searching for information reads them. I think making them collapsed by default would be great, to minimize page length and distraction. However, both the collapsible table trick and the NavFrame trick didn't work on content with subsections in them. Something like ShowHide or ToggleDisplay would help a lot. Can some of the admin install it?Jimreynold2nd 04:13, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

You'll get a faster response if you post this at Chloe's talk page. Master Bigode 04:26, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Chloe installed ToggleDisplay2. It can be used like this: <toggledisplay showtext="Show this" hidetext="Hide this"> asdf </toggledisplay> --Dory 01:06, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

I just had a look at Reimu's page, and having the show/hide there has removed the sections from the table of contents. I'm not sure this is such a good idea... especially since if you want to skip past them you can just click "4 Book Synopsis" in the ToC, or just keep hitting pagedown/spacebar. Keiji 10:24, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
I see that as an advantage. My rationale: (1-about ToC) Not many people read the official profiles, at least not as much as the general information/story/fandom above it (and soon there will be "Spellcards" section). And thus, it should not occupy more space on the ToC than the other, more popular content. The fact that the pages are being restructured (not yet for Reimu), and the ToC would have more than just "General" and "Fun facts" further supports this. (2-about hiding) The "Official profiles" part serves mostly as a reference, people read it mainly when they are looking for it, thus it should not occupy more space on a page than information people come to "read" when they want to find out who Reimu is in general; and as such it makes perfect sense to hide it. The problem is not "going to the Book Synopsys section", but rather "The page is too long". Dory 21:20, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
I don't think not including a section of a page that you deem "unpopular" is ever good. Imagine if a law book omitted sections of the book from the TOC because they figured it was "unpopular". --Tsukihime 00:07, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

I'm personally OK with the show/hide thing, but I think that the show/hide message is too small. Master Bigode 00:16, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

^This. It should stand out a little more. At the very least the text shouldn't be so small. Pufferfish101 13:18, 11 February 2011 (UTC)
Thinking a little about it, the size of the message shouldn't be an issue if we only hide the profiles, but not the section headings. That would fix the TOC issue too. Master Bigode 20:55, 12 February 2011 (UTC)
Why would someone put the section headings inside the toggle tags is beyond me. Is there any way to include the toggledisplay in some help file, and mention how it affects header behavior? Anatole serial 18:36, 13 February 2011 (UTC)
Info on the toggle could be added as a guideline for character articles. Master Bigode 18:46, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

User:Master Bigode, I like your way to do it. I dont know how to increase text size without editting CSS tho.Dory 02:03, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Incomplete profiles

What do we do with official profiles that don't appear to be complete? ie: Meirin's IaMP profile. It would be harder to see what is done or not done if we just hid them --Tsukihime 21:17, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Our own TH RPG

So I was bored and thought maybe we can produce our own RPG using RPGmaker or something. Graphics, story, scripts, dialog; it would require effort from all sorts of people --Tsukihime 18:53, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

There are at least 3 or 4 people at MotK who can make music, as well as a considerable number of people who can draw. I also think I can make sprites if I'm given lineart or sketches to work with, but I don't feel confident about my skills since I've not sprited anything in a long while. Master Bigode 20:44, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
I just started RPG maker yesterday but I feel I can make something from start to finish even if it's only 5 minutes long lol. Maybe we can just start with something small and amuse ourselves with our work. Make a design so flexible that we can just insert it into a story and it'll still make sense! --Tsukihime 13:50, 7 February 2011 (UTC)


Making an RPG is no easy task. I've seen too many projects that started but never finished...Pufferfish101 06:13, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
Same. Though, that's usually cause the developers had too much on their plates with worldly matters and couldn't do it anymore. Or got bored. On the other hand, what if we made it so that everyone could freely contribute? Source code would be available to all so that even when the main coders aren't available others would still be able to continue development. We take our wiki and extend it to a game. --Tsukihime 13:50, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
Incidentally, I've been hacking Touhou Mother to make more characters playable. That was mainly over Christmas though, and I haven't had time to work on it since... and goodness, the original code is awful from a programmer's perspective. It doesn't help that RM2k is not at all easy to work with in terms of scripting. Keiji 10:21, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
I am not sure what engine we should use. Does anyone have any preferences? I got RMXP cause that seemed pretty popular although a lot of people seem to be using VX instead. After 5 hours of fooling around I figured out enough of the basics to get some game logic going and just started to look at RGSS scripting lol —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tsukihime (talkcontribs) 13:50, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
I've heard from a friend of mine who's experienced with the various RM versions that XP is actually better than VX, apparently for the sake of being "idiot friendly" they took out some useful things when they made VX. But I haven't personally used anything but 2k. Keiji 18:10, 7 February 2011 (UTC)
I stuck to XP because of the ability to change battle backgrounds on the fly. With VX, changing backgrounds during the battle is pretty difficult (if not impossible). Especially for a touhou-themed game, I can't imagine how you would show that a boss is using a Last Word spell card or not if you used the same background for everything! But there are a lot of nice scripts available for XP. Can you believe this is scripted in RPG maker? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQwViGmy8Ao. Well aside from the fact that XP has been out longer than VX and therefore logically would have more scripts, there are a lot of people that are split between "should I go do everything for this new script-engine or not?" --Tsukihime 05:09, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
For XP, I'm not surprised, XP was a huge overhaul. But as for "changing backgrounds during the battle", I will just point out that Touhou Mother doesn't use RM's built-in battle system at all - it uses a map for the battle screen, "events" for each digit and player name/sprite and "Pictures" for the enemy sprites and the entire menu (S-chan was obviously using a modded RM2k for this, because he goes up to Picture #50 - I had to ResHack my copy to get it to work).
Anyway, that specific case aside, I'd wager it's easier to just make your battle scene like this using a map than to do it in an actual RM2k battle - RM2k battles aren't even Turing-complete (though are annoyingly close to it!).
Plus when it comes down to it it'd probably just be easier to use Game Maker (I like to be retro and stick with 5.3A, but while 7 isn't much more advanced I heard 8 is much better for special effects) than any version of RPG Maker. Keiji 14:31, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
No. You are not replacing a battle engine with a bunch of "events" and "pictures" accessing your random set of switches and variables. Anyone who ever did object-oriented programming will agree that this concept goes against all present structures and requires a huge amount of braindead low-level managing. As a comparison, it's like developing the game itself in your favorite programming language, while writing the battle system in pure assembly. (Besides, RMXP adds a huge overhead of Ruby processing to each event, which probably makes the resulting system feel incredibly slow.)
RMXP gives you scripting functionality which directly lets you modify the battle engine on the same programming level it was made on. This will allow you object-oriented access and modification of all the data you possibly want to use and then some. You can even use all the data you can edit in the database, which wasn't possible with 2k. And adding a feature for changing backgrounds during battle should only require a bit of searching what to modify in the scripts, writing a function, and then calling it from the event scripts when necessary.
Seriously, this is why I won't recommend using RPG Maker 2000/2003. Besides, that engine is over 10 years old now. Seeing people still recommending (!) wasting lots of time and organization effort in creating a pseudo-engine based on this event system makes me rage.
tl;dr: Keep the events for simple, plot-driving stuff, and don't use them for complex UI systems. You have a scripting engine for that. --NamelessLegacy 15:08, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
What are you getting so worked up about? S-chan DID replace a battle system with a bunch of events and pictures, there's no denying that. Sure, it's a bad programming paradigm, but if RM2k is all you can use, it's the best you can do, and in fact it's rather innovative! But as I said, I'd recommend Game Maker over RPG Maker anyway. Keiji 10:28, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
Someone on RPGRPGRevolution forums (large forums for RM games, scripts, and resources) wanted to make a complex active time battle system similar to star ocean or the tales series. People recommended Game Maker over RM. Anyone have experience with Game Maker? I saw some sample games screenshots and saw a nice mario game! --Tsukihime 16:00, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
I have loads of experience with Game Maker 5.3a. No idea how much has changed in the later versions. Don't have the time to commit to anything big though. Keiji 22:21, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
Simple mini-games would be good enough. We can post a bunch of our creations for free, then some people might become interested and start making their own larger projects. --Tsukihime 23:09, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Oh dear god RPG Maker....good for some things, but otherwise very limited in what it can let you do. I've been working on my own TH RPG for the past 2 years now, and still only 50% done. Mainly due to how limited the system is, I can't do half of what I wanted to do with it. VX/XP are good yes, but you'll probably have to make all of the resources yourselves, as I recall there being not that many resources for either of those. I'd stick with 2k3, but again, it's limited with what you can and can't do (enemies don't have levels, damage formula is wack for physical attack, don't even have magic defense, etc....). Just so much that COULD have been done, but WASN'T done...but that's my two cents on this. Xenomic 08:37, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

That's true. Then again, in the worst case, we'd go ahead and write custom scripts to accomplish what is wanted. For me, I don't really want to write a game engine from scratch just to get certain things I wanted in. There are probably other game engines that do provide the kind of features that would be sought for though --Tsukihime 15:00, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
Perhaps, though it also depends on how in-depth you WANT to go too I suppose. I haven't messed with VX/XP to know exactly what they can do, but I HAVE seen some of what it's capable of in a way from the Touhou - FFXI RPG on Nico. Xenomic 20:37, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Spell card pages

So I'm looking through some spell card pages and notice this massive table of contents that just says "Spell Card 1, Spell Card 2, ... " which I have to say isn't particularly useful and just looks bad. Maybe we can just plug in __NOTOC__ to all of them? --Tsukihime 15:00, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

It provides anchor links. --WGH 15:21, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
I usually provide anchor links when users can look at the title and know exactly where they want to go. The only thing I can see is that people can jump to a card "somewhere near the bottom of the page" rather than scrolling down. --Tsukihime 15:28, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Doujin arrange groups that don't release albums

Talk:List_by_Groups#Ezel-Ash. I've noticed this in other places as well, where artists may release individual arrangements on their website for download. Should we get this kind of info as well? --Tsukihime 04:43, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

I agree. I've also find an artist called Gauche. He may also be a part of a group called "水車小屋", but this isn't on the wiki as well. --User:Tony64 08:09, 16 February 2011 (GMT)
Especially that kind of info! Making freely available content available on the wiki is always a good idea. And a release through the typical Japanese doujin channels shouldn't be a requirement for a mention here.
That's true. I don't think the original intent of list by groups was to filter out freely distributed works though, but it was easy to organize and get it out there. It's just that no one did it lol --Tsukihime 14:09, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
In fact, I propose creating an entire new list page for doujin artists who release arrangements for free download.
Of course, this should not contain every single arrange by every single artist you can possibly find. But if you randomly happen to find something you like, you can just add it.
This will also give us an edge over Wikia's planned collaboration with YouTube arrangers.--NamelessLegacy 11:35, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
Right now I'm not sure if there are any solid plans to extend the doujin circles, but I can imagine three places where this information would go: List by Song, Circle/artist page, and the new "individual" works. I will push out a new doujin circle portal that will list all of the doujin circles we have on our wiki (I will start with music) and have appropriate links set up. The new page will be a really rough dump of data, but that can be cleaned up later if necessary. Getting the information out is more important than aesthetics for the most part --Tsukihime 14:09, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

Doujin Circle page

I quickly put together a circle page that summarizes all of the Doujin_Circles. --Tsukihime 15:37, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

I've also created a doujin portal as well as a main page for conventions. --Tsukihime 13:27, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Really large (image) files

So I took a glance through the list of images and found that we have some extremely large images.

The List

ex: 7.6 MB image, with a 202 KB preview on the file page. However I don't think the preview is the one being loaded and it is actually loading up the entire 7.6 MB's.

File:20101007214419!Image0001cover.jpg

Should we go and make them smaller? I'm not sure how version control works but I imagine multiple copies of the same file are stored on the server? I'm only focused on making sure that when we actually load the image, it's going to be the smaller one. We can keep the high-quality ones if necessary, but they shouldn't be the ones being loaded up (if they are). --Tsukihime 19:20, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Hmm actually if I just specify custom dimensions, it isn't too bad. --Tsukihime 19:28, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

New sidebar section: Doujin stuff

It wouldn't be called "Doujin stuff" but it will link to all the main doujin pages:

And more. That would mean most of the existing sections would have only one or two items, but we could probably fill it up somehow. --Tsukihime 20:32, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Good idea! How about calling it "Fanworks", then? Anatole serial 21:30, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
I don't know what it will be called. I think "Doujin" sounds better only cause I see it more often when I'm looking for games, but I guess if the english audience is more familiar with "fanworks"... Well it's just a heading lol --Tsukihime 02:16, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
Doujin would exclude all fanworks not considered doujin, though I can't think of any examples right now.
Another possible word we can use is derivative. - Kiefmaster99 20:19, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
Derivative would be a good term that would encompass all of them. But then our Print Work section would be reduced to only one link as well (for which we might as well just toss it into a new "Official stuff" heading). I thought about separating doujin stuff from fanworks, but then I'm sure a lot of people would be going "so where does this go?" --Tsukihime 23:14, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

New front page

IMO, we should just link to other games instead of linking to the list of fangames and every seihou game in the front page. Master Bigode 00:45, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

That would make sense. Only official stuff should be on the frontpage. --Tsukihime 01:24, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

Isn't the series of Three Mischievous Fairies manga called Touhou Sangetsusei, not Touhou Sangessei? -- SuddenFrost 07:20, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

Fan animations

So recently I was going through youtube and watching random touhou animations and figured maybe we should have some pages with links to them as well! --Tsukihime 01:17, 20 February 2011 (UTC)