Talk:Gensokyo

From Touhou Wiki
Jump to navigation Jump to search

Kanji and Translation[edit]

Is it alright to move kanji and translation info into the main paragraph? Numerous pages in the Bestiary have Japanese and its accompanying translations immediately under the title (see Maid, Human, and Youkai for examples). I think the latter format makes them easier to spot at a glance. And it looks nicer IMHO.

--Deciare 15:05, 14 May 2005 (PDT)

What makes things interesting about these pages you brought up was that I placed the kanji above the paragraph in some cases (like Maid), and I was the one who placed them in the main paragraph in the later cases (as in Vampire). I was planning to move them inside the main paragraph for all cases, but you have a good point. Maybe it would be better if I left them above the main paragraph. What do others think about this?
My argument for moving it down is that it looks more professional and doesn't reduce the clarity as much as you claim. Also, it is the standard that Wikipedia uses (check out "Shinto shrine" or "Dim sum" or "anime" for examples).
--Leviathean 16:02, 14 May 2005 (PDT)

Romanization[edit]

The English-speaking Tôhô community seems to be going for wâpuro-style romanization in almost all things (Touhou, Saigyouji, etc. etc.), yet everyone insists on calling Gensôkyô Gensokyo. The reason for this somehow eludes me. Might someone clarify? --爆龍 01:28, 8 July 2007 (PDT)

Personally I normally go by whatever spelling I saw first. This can cause serious problems, but since I don't know the differences between the different styles of romanization it's about all I have to go on. So suppose the first time I saw the word "Gensokyo" it was spelled like that. I would probably spell it the same way after that because it's the way I first learned the word. If I first see a different style for a different word, I might not be aware it's been written in a different style and I would then spell that other word like that from then on even if I'm mixing styles. Another possible issue is that in English we don't really use accent marks except on foreign words. Even then we often don't bother to add the marks because we're either A. too lazy to bother (it's true) or B. we wouldn't know where to put them even if we tried. Most of us just never learned how to use accent marks to begin with and I honestly do not know how to pronounce an ô. Something like ou I could at least try to pronounce. -Redpanda
In Japanese, the difference is quite clear: o is just a short o (think, say, the o in the word “sock”), whereas ô (or oo, or ō, or ou - they all mean the same thing) is a long version of the same sound, [o:] (a in “talk”). There's a meaningful difference between the two. English spelling, on the other hand, is highly irregular, and probably leads for both being pronounced the same way (more like -aw, adding an extraneous u-sound to the end, which is, of course, quite evil). --爆龍 02:54, 8 July 2007 (PDT)
Well, it's official.
PCB Phantasm: Phantasmagoria. She was also living on the border of Gensokyo. -7HS
I think we had better not follow that spelling; we don't adopt many names of character like Meiling and Shizuha. 幻想郷 is not げんそきょ (Gensokyo) but げんそうきょう (Gensoukyou). "ou" is more natural, I think. --masuo64 Talk 18:23, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
This I'm more ambivalent, and torn between two sides. I'm hesitant to rename this only because this spelling is so strongly ingrained in the history of English Touhou fandom. Of course, history by itself isn't a good reason to not change it, and if it weren't for this, I'd support changing it. I also think that ZUN may have thought of "Tokyo" (Tōkyō) when he romanized the name, and at least in that sense, "Gensokyo" is somewhat acceptable. - Kiefmaster99 19:20, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
Just to clarify, treat my position as an abstention. - Kiefmaster99 14:46, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Sealing of Gensokyo[edit]

Uh... regarding the statement of the moon landing... if Gensokyo were sealed at 1865, and the statement that humans were invading the moon refers in particular to the first moon landing (the Apollo 11 mission, where "these humans [first] stuck a flag on the moon")... well, that landing took place in 1969, which is still "more than" a century rather than nearly one; in any case I don't know where the 2003 date comes in (as Reisen's arrival in Gensokyo, where she discloses this factoid, predates the actual incidence of Imperishable Night by a few decades). (also I'm bad at wikiformatting so I'm just going to post this the way it is. >_>)

Err... where did you see that Gensokyo was sealed in 1865? I remember I was a bit confused when I first wrote that top paragraph, but didn't think I actually mentioned that date.
Additional evidence: Meiling's BGM is "Shanghai Alice of Meiji 17", which was 1884. Of course, she could have entered after the sealing, but I don't think she's powerful enough for that- especially back then.
-7HS 23:04, 6 June 2006 (PDT)
(me again... maybe I should make an account, 'cept I don't know much about these games ^^;) The Gensokyo article gives that as the precise date. Now, where it cites that from, you couldn't ask me <_<
Are there any official sources proving the date of sealing (1884 or 1885)? I don't know Japanese good enough to find it at Japanese Touhou Wiki, where chronology is translated from.
I'd imagine that 1885 comes from "subtract 120 from the release date of Phantasmagoria of Flower View." This would mean that they started with "year 0" when they started counting; if they'd been doing things the same way they did AD/CE and BC ("2009th year of Common Era" as opposed to "2009 years since Common Era began" -- there's no such thing as "AD 0" or "0 BC"), PoFV would actually have to take place in Gensokyo year 121. Just thought I'd add in a bit more confusion ... —Kimiko 17:06, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

PCB Timeline[edit]

Hang on, the PCB Prologue states that the winter was raging on even in May. Why is PCB down as 21 March? PCB EX will have to be shifted in accordance once this is fixed (+10 days from PCB itself).

Calendar drift, apparently. The Japanese wiki page states "118/03/21(2004/05/09)東方妖々夢本編 / (幻想郷縁起)春雪異変" -7HS

IN Timeline[edit]

So supposedly Kaguya arrived on earth 1,200 years ago, that number is written all over the wiki. But then why does the timeline say the backstory for IN (which begins with her arriving on earth) was 672-707 A.D.? That's at least 1,300 years ago. I'm hoping someone doesn't point out a fatal flaw in my math, but no matter how I look at it this timeline is saying she's been here 100ish years longer than the entire rest of the wiki.

Yeah, most of the Eientei cast is said to be "at least 1200 years" of age on this wiki, but I can't find any references to it in canon. I'm guessing it was an estimate based on the date the Kaguya-hime story first originated... except that's thought to be the 9th century. Perhaps a few hundred years were added for good measure?
In any case, I'm inclined to trust the Japanese THwiki. Even if we don't understand how they came up with their date either, they probably know better. >_> -7HS
Personally I've no recollection of the "1200" number - I've always remembered it as "13 centuries ago". --Psieye
Cage in Lunatic Runagate states 1300 outright. —Kimiko 19:50, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

SSiB's Place in the Timeline[edit]

What's the canonical source for Silent Sinner in Blue taking place before Mountain of Faith? I ask because Reimu and Marisa make an explicit reference to the events of MoF in chapter 5. (Unless it happened between chapters ...) —Kimiko 19:50, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

SSiB only begins before MoF. If you follow the story, it includes several moths of "nothing happening" in which MoF transpires. At current, SSiB is in the winter season while the first comic was in spring or summer (i forgot) whereas MoF was in autumn.

Synchronizing the timeline with the jp Wiki[edit]

If no-one minds, I'll be including info from the far more definitive obsessive official Japanese Touhou Wiki's chronology of the world of Gensokyo from http://thwiki.info/?%B8%B8%C1%DB%B6%BF%C7%AF%C9%BD . Unless there's a better place to put that info instead of here, I'll start tomorrow or the day after. TheTrueBlue 09:01, October 25, 2009 (UTC)

It was originally taken from there and haven't been synced with it since MOF, so please do.--Umhyuk 17:44, October 25, 2009 (UTC)

misc.[edit]

With regard to "country" vs. "land", I can't speak from the perspective of a native Japanese speaker, but "land" seems better to me. If we look at some of the compounds containing 郷 from its Unihan database page, we get 異郷 as "strange land", 近郷 as "countryside", and 理想郷 as "ideal land".

It seems to me that the idea that's being transmitted with 郷 in these examples is not "country", a large area with rigid borders and government (as the word implies in English), but rather "land", an indistinct geographical location defined more by a collection of people than by law.

Besides, "Illusion Country" just sounds dumber than "Land of Illusions." glasnost0 21:47, 29 January 2009 (UTC)


It seems that During the Scarlet Weather Rhapsody, The gods of Moriya shrine made a plan to gain more faith.

Also, the Hakurei Shrine was destroyed by an Earthquake. We should add it too. Dandan550 00:15, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

Shoot the Bullet and Double Spoiler[edit]

I noticed that these two are absent from the timeline. Is it because no one knows where they fit in, an oversight, or some other reason? UTW 23:37, May 8, 2010 (UTC)

Fairy Wars[edit]

Anyone knows the time of which the events of Fairy Wars took place? RegalStar 20:13, 28 November 2010 (PST)

That map...[edit]

From where does it come from? If it isn't official, i suppose it shouldn't be here. PK (talk) 12:14, 9 March 2016 (UTC)